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Creators of Python, Perl, SQL, STL and Scheme—all Excellence in Programming award-winners—debate the importance of languages.
Five of IT’s greats participated in a rambling discussion at SD West on Tuesday, March 15, 2005, moderated by Jonathan Erickson, editor in chief of Dr. Dobb’s Journal. The talk was understandably skewed toward languages, given the presence of Python creator Guido van Rossum, Java and Scheme co-creator Guy Steele Jr., Perl creator Larry Wall, SQL co-creator Don Chamberlin and the C++ Standard Template Library creator Alexander Stepanov. Each offered spirited insights into the role of literature, math and learning in software development. Here are highlights:
On the greatest language:
Steele: “I’m tempted to say the Java was the best language of the decade, but I think Javasript has the better claim. The worst languages are HQ9Plus and Befunge. Very few people have ever used them, however, so they haven’t caused much harm.”
Chamberlin: “There’s a tendency to feel like something that’s more complicated is better. Languages today have too many features, and the effect in the aggregate is a decline in the elegance of computer languages.”
Stepanov: “I believe the greatest programmer ever is [Donald] Knuth. Knuth uses C. Let me make a great pitch for C. Why is English a great language? Because Shakespeare and Dickens and Trollope wrote in it. The moment I see great code bases written in Haskell or Perl, for example, then I will revise my view.”
Van Rossum: “English is a great language because it’s everybody’s second language. English is the lingua franca. Underneath Python, Perl, Haskell and the Java Virtual Machine is probably a C implementation that makes it all possible.”
On the role of mathematics:
Wall: “I think there’s a cultural balkanization going on. There have always been language wars and editor wars. There seems to be a breakdown—different realms of computer science are not informing each other. You can blame it on postmodernism if you like. I tend to come from a linguistic side of things rather than the mathematical side, but the two need to talk to each other.”
Van Rossum: “Mathematicians have had very little to add to the world of programming, and in that sense I have to disagree with the concept of mathematics being a foundation for programming.”
On the learning process:
Chamberlin: “I wish I had more time for learning. The most effect way for me to learn something is to teach it.”
Wall: “Try to learn something very different than what you already know. For instance, I’m now learning Japanese, which is different from Indo-European languages. I always thought reverse Polish notation was very strange, until I learned Japanese and realized that they speak reverse Polish notation.”
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